How Is The Leader’s Mindset Evolving? — with guest Terence Mauri

Chris Curran: Growth Igniters Radio with Pam Harper and Scott Harper. Episode 157 − How Is The Leader’s Mindset Evolving? This episode is brought to you by Business Advancement Incorporated, enabling successful leaders and companies to accelerate to their next level of success. On the web at BusinessAdvance.com. And now, here’s Pam and Scott.

Pam Harper: Thanks Chris. I’m Pam Harper, Founding Partner and CEO of Business Advancement Incorporated. And sitting right across from me, as always is my business partner and husband, Scott Harper. Hi Scott.

Scott Harper: Hey there, Pam. It’s a pleasure to join you again for another episode of growth igniters radio and as always, our purpose is to spark new insights, inspiration, and immediately useful ideas for visionary leaders to take themselves and their companies to their next level of innovation, growth and game-changing success.

Now Pam, Fortune has just released their 2019 list of the world’s 50 greatest leaders. As in years past, it’s a diverse group of leaders from business, government, education, nongovernmental organizations, and other places as well. Now this year, these leaders are being honored for the focus on their courage and optimism as they take bold risks to make the world a better place.

Pam Harper: Yes. In many cases, we found that the leaders were being honored for upending, long-standing assumptions about leadership. Now, while these may not be new to those of you listening, the fact that it is being formally acknowledged to me shows a significant shift in acceptance of changing cultural norms.

Scott Harper: So what are some of these assumptions that are being upended here?

Pam Harper: Well, one that I see is that leadership flows from power. That’s a traditional kind of response, right? But in this case, not everyone is overtly a powerful person. In addition to business leaders, this year’s group ranges from a 16-year-old climate activist to a graduate researcher challenging some of the bias of Ai to women in the US Congress and more. The bottom line is if you’re committed to an issue or a cause and are willing to do what it takes to move it forward, even when the path isn’t clear, then you can be a leader.

Scott Harper: Another longstanding assumption about leadership is that in order to inspire followers, leaders have to constantly express very strong confidence that whatever it is they’re going to be doing is going to succeed.

Pam Harper: Yes. But this year’s leaders are publicly saying that they’re not entirely sure what they’re leading is going to turn out as planned. So for instance, Tim Cook of Apple is leading the introduction of a subscription service and this is a real departure away from what they’re known for.

Scott Harper: And he said that although they are not sure that this is going to work for Apple, if it does, it’s going to be another huge change in their business model that takes them to a whole new level of growth.

Pam Harper: That’s better than doing the same thing over and over again and risking being disrupted. So these leaders are being honored because, in a turbulent fast-changing world, we can’t depend upon doing the same things over and over to move forward. These visionary leaders are committed to taking prudent risks to go beyond their established success and go into uncharted territory to find new success.

Scott Harper: And this turns on its head another assumption, which is that to be a successful leader, you have to build upon a successful track record doing something that’s worked again.

Pam Harper: Yet the people in this year’s list show something different. They are inventing completely outside of what has always worked. So they’re taking traditional NGOs and they’re creating a new business model. They’re reinventing ways to fund women-led companies. They’re doing all kinds of things that have just simply not been done before.

Scott Harper: So no track record, and yet they are showing strong leadership.

Pam Harper: That’s right. And by doing that, they’re creating new opportunities to make the world a better place.

Scott Harper: Okay, so these leaders are turning long-held assumptions on their head. Is there a common theme to what distinguishes these people?

Pam Harper: All of this points to a growing acceptance of a different type of leadership mindset that is best suited to finding our way in a turbulent world. Again, the fact that this is being honored in Fortune magazine is an acknowledgment that this kind of broader thinking, this risk-taking, all of this is making its way into the mainstream.

Scott Harper: And this is very interesting because just a few years ago when this kind of thinking was still just emerging, we had a really interesting conversation with Terence Mauri, who is the author of the award-winning book, The Leader’s Mindset.

Pam Harper: So let’s go back and revisit that conversation, because Terrence had a great way of putting things.

Scott Harper: And here’s a bit of Terence’s background. He’s a writer and a mentor who is based in the UK and is a global authority on how to win in the age of disruption. Terence serves as a mentor in residence for Future Ideas, an international community of experts that includes some of the world’s biggest thinkers. So with that, let’s pick up on our conversation with Terence Mauri. Stay with us…

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Pam Harper: Terence, welcome to Growth Igniters Radio!

Terence Mauri: Hi, Pam. Hi, Scott. Great to be on your show.

Pam Harper: We’re so happy that you could join us. Of course, this is a very interesting time to be joining us, too.

Terence Mauri: I’m here in the center of London as we speak. As your listeners will be aware, these are unprecedented times of the back of the Brexit vote. There are high levels of uncertainty and anxiety across the country. It just highlights the age of disruption that we now need to live in and thrive in.

Pam Harper: So let’s start out by having you tell us a little bit about you and what inspired you to write your book now. Of course, you couldn’t have forecast, could you? All of this?

Terence Mauri: I can say the timing of this was not planned. It’s certainly quite telling. It came as a complete surprise. I actually voted remain. I’m Irish-Italian; I grew up in the UK so I’m British; I’m European though as well. This whole disruptive event has really affected everybody, hearts and minds.

I’d like to give you 3 fast facts about me. Number one − I’m a mentor for entrepreneurs and business people around the world. I also act as a senior adviser for the London Business School helping entrepreneurs build the future. Number 2 − I’m an avid learner; I write and speak about entrepreneurship to Fortune 500 companies, startups, and business schools around the world.

Finally, number 3 − the inspiration of my book, The Leader’s Mindset, came actually from a talk I attended in Switzerland at Davos, The World Economic Forum. It was John Chambers, the CEO of Cisco Systems. There’s one key point which resonated with me and really gave me this feeling that I needed to write this book, which was this: he said, “If you don’t innovate fast enough, disrupt yourself, disrupt your industry, disrupt your business you’ll be left behind.” Those words really rang true for me when I look around the environment looking at the tremendous risk that we now face not only as leaders but also the tremendous opportunities as well.

Scott Harper: What we’ve often said is, “If you don’t change the game for yourself someone else will change it for you.” We’re right on board with you for that.

One of the things you talked about in your book, Terence, is a concept you call “10X.” What is the significance of this 10X for the leader’s mindset, and why is it especially appropriate in this age of uncertainty and disruption when things are happening so fast?

Terence Mauri: Thanks, Scott. It’s a great question. I would like to frame it for the listeners. Astro Teller is a British scientist; he heads up Google X, which is like a futuristic lab, part of the Alphabet Group, and it’s responsible for 10X projects like Google’s self-driving car and Google glass as well. 10X is really about thinking bigger and bolder. If you think about it, most leaders, most organizations think incrementally. They think about improving things by 10% or 20% or 30%. 10X was created to disrupt that level of thinking, so that you’re thinking up to 10 times bigger.

I’d like to give you an example to really illustrate 10X in action. In terms of the power of 10X thinking there are tests that you can apply to see if you’re thinking big enough. This is when I would say is this idea of 10 times rather than 10%. Imagine you make the car that goes 50 miles a gallon. You can’t just retool the engine you already have. But if I tell you it has to run on a gallon of gas of let’s say 500 miles, you’re gonna have to completely rethink how to overcome that challenge. What 10X thinking does counterintuitively, weirdly, is generate perspective shifting. It’s much more powerful, and can really move mountains. The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, for example − I think that’s a good example of a 10X project, to wipe out malaria around the world. 10X is really about thinking bigger, it’s thinking bolder. Given the recent events with Brexit, geopolitical uncertainties, war, famine, I think there’s never been a greater moment in our history for big, courageous thinkers.

Scott Harper: You’re not just expanding your frame, you’re changing the entire canvas, and going into a whole new medium of thought.

Terence Mauri: Yes. I think this is a good way of describing it.

Pam Harper: What’s interesting about the book as you wrote it is that you talk about 3 action-oriented mindsets, you call them, that make up the leader’s mindset. While we’re going to go into this in more depth in the next segment if you can give us an overview of how this all works together toward 10X thinking that will be really helpful.

Terence Mauri: Well, the leader’s mindset is a missing link for a new way of thinking. What I discovered through my research, speaking to organizations, leaders, and entrepreneurs around the world is that many leaders are still using outdated 20th-century mindsets to compete. I think this is a shortcut to failure. No one wants a Kodak moment if I can say that. We’ve seen some casualties over the last 3 years including Kodak, Nokia, Blockbuster, the European Union − the list goes on.

There are 3 critical mindsets that need 10X-ing, that need amplifying in the age of disruption. Briefly, they are thinking bigger, which is about shaping the future and finding your why, your leadership purpose; that’s number one. Number 2 is about acting bolder so it’s about taking risks and practicing 20 seconds of daily courage in your life. Finally, number 3 is about learning faster; it’s about being a knowledge seeker. What I discovered is that adopting a beginner’s mindset, being passionately curious, and having relentless determination is really the secret source of a leader’s mindset.

Pam Harper: What’s really interesting about this… because the people that we speak with, that are our clients, already are thinking big, as I said. This concept of thinking and saying, “Yes, we have to think even bigger” [is the real challenge,] and how to get into this is the key. We know it on the 30,000-foot level, but what we really need to do is to delve into it and really understand how this is really different. I read this book and it meant a lot to me. I’m looking forward to talking with you more about it in the next segment. Just to sum it up, in the age of disruption you really have to be able to think with a totally different perspective and shift it.

With that, we’ll take a quick break, and when we come back we’ll speak more with Terence Mauri about the 3 action-related mindsets you must 10X to win in the age of disruption. Stay with us.

Scott Harper: This is Growth Igniters Radio with Pam Harper and Scott Harper, brought to you by Business Advancement Inc. We focus on enabling visionary leaders to ignite, sustain, and boost the momentum it takes to get game-changing results. We’re on the Web at businessadvance.com.

Pam Harper: We’d like to welcome our listeners, and especially our many new listeners. If you’re not already subscribed to our Growth Igniters community, you can get even more value by signing up. You’ll receive reminders of our new bi-weekly podcasts along with a link to a page filled with all kinds of resources. On off weeks, you’ll receive a Growth Igniters post, which is about a two-minute read.

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Pam Harper: Welcome back to Growth Igniters Radio with Pam Harper − that’s me − and Scott Harper. Scott and I are talking today with Terence Mauri, writer and mentor, about the leader’s mindset for winning in the age of disruption. Terence, how can people find out more about you and your book?

Terence Mauri: Thanks, Pam. Well, first of all I recommend my website which is www.terencemauri.com. You can also join my community on Twitter @terencemauri. In terms of the book the book is physically out in bookstores across America on October the 4th. I’ll be coming to the USA for book signings and really looking forward to meeting thinkers and doers. People can go to Amazon.com or Barnes and Noble or Indie books or Goodreads to get the book, The Leader’s Mindset.

Pam Harper: We can have a virtual book launch here.

Terence Mauri: Yes.

Pam Harper: Is that the idea?

Terence Mauri: Exactly. I’m coming … I’m a great fan of the USA. I’ve really enjoyed visiting on many occasions and I’ll be spending about 6 weeks in your country from late September.

Pam Harper: Your people will be able to see where your stops will be on your website

Okay, let’s talk now in a little more detail about the 3 mindsets. Let’s start off by talking about the think big mindset. What exactly would you say it is − and what isn’t it?

Terence Mauri: It’s a great question. To give some context there are many mindsets that are critical, I think, for winning in the age of disruption. What I wanted to do in the book is really zero in and amplify what I believe are 3 critical mindsets, and the think big mindset is the first one. It means 2 things in summary. One, it means finding your why − your leadership purpose. There’s a great talk about this by Simon Sinek who wrote the book Start With Why.

Pam Harper: Yes; we reviewed that in our Spring book pairing episode, number 58.

Terence Mauri: It’s a fantastic insight into the importance of purpose. That’s the first part of thinking big, which is you’ve got to really think about what makes you feel alive. When does your heart beat faster? What legacy do you want to leave on the planet? You should move every fiber of your body in that direction. Finding your purpose, and really thinking about 3 types of benefits, 1 − people, 2 − the planet, and 3 − profit. This triple bottom line I think is a very useful framework for deciding where your purpose is and what mark you want to leave on the planet.

There’s a bit of urgency there, because I discovered during my research that if we’re lucky we have about 960 months to live. I don’t want to depress our listeners; I certainly don’t want to create anxiety there, but actually by confronting that reality … I mean I’ve discovered that I’ve got about 500 months left. What it does there is create urgency. It creates urgency because we often accommodate or say yes to things that aren’t helping us. It helps to filter through and focus on what really matters. That’s the first part of the think big mindset, which is about purpose.

The second part is what I call acuity of vision. It’s really this clarity of mind of where you want to be − so it’s “the vision thing.” To illustrate that, I met a really inspirational leader called John Wood, and I describe him as the apostle of thinking big. John Wood was a Senior Executive at Microsoft. He’d been working there many years and very successful. One day he looked out of his window in Seattle and decided he needed a break, he needed a holiday, so he decided to go to Nepal and did 3 weeks of trekking. Little did he know but that’s holiday was going to change his life and the lives of millions of others forever.

When he got there he discovered a school at the top of one of the mountains. He was invited into the school by the headmaster. There were about a hundred children − smiling, beaming faces. The headmaster said to John, “John, if you ever come back to visit us and visit the kids, could you bring a few books?” Because there were no books, there were zero books in the school library. At that moment John started to think big. He knew that he could not go back to selling software for the rest of his life. He made a decision right there that he was going to quit his job and he returned 6 months later with an old yak − his father joined him − and they had a hundred books on the back of this yak. That was 10 years ago, and John created this think big vision which was to donate over 20 million books to deprived areas around the world. His motto is ‘if you can learn to read you can read to learn. John Wood I think is a vivid, real-life example of this think big mindset.

Pam Harper: He wasn’t just thinking big, he was feeling big, too. I mean… It was something that was beyond just an everyday kind of thing. He had to literally shift his head [and heart].

Terence Mauri: It’s a great way, yeah.

Pam Harper: Yes. You said there was more to it, though − thinking big.

Terence Mauri: Yeah. This thinking big, it’s about purpose, it’s about vision. It’s also really about − like you said, it’s an action-oriented mindset.

Pam Harper: So often people will rationalize, and they’ll say, “I have a constraint, I don’t have enough time,” or …

Scott Harper: Resources or people or whatever.

Pam Harper: Yes.

Terence Mauri: There’s always going to be reasons not to do it.

Pam Harper: How do you determine then if you’re thinking big enough. You might say well, I’m thinking big enough given the situation I’m in, but it doesn’t sound like that is what these people are doing.

Scott Harper: Sometimes the constraint can actually generate that thought.

Pam Harper: What do you think, Terence?

Terence Mauri: Some excellent points. I think it’s important to embrace constraints. Often big companies − they’re slow, they’re bureaucratic. Their success can ironically sometimes plant the seeds of their demise. I think scarcity can actually create more resourcefulness. That’s a really important point for our listeners which is I think in order to think big you need to act small.

An example of that would be experimentation. Yes, think big but then actually experiment, prototype the idea, test it, learn from it, iterate. If it’s not working, pivot and move forward. It’s really more of a scientific approach to ideas, testing, evaluating, measuring, moving fast, executing quickly. If you’re allowing the excuse culture or inertia to kick in, and then it’s very easy to waste invaluable time; that 960 months is ticking away.

Scott Harper: The first step is this thinking big. But thinking, as you say, doesn’t do anything unless you act on it. The second action-oriented mindset you’ve spoken about is being bold. You mentioned a number of Japanese leadership and management philosophies. One is sisu; what role does this play?

Terence Mauri: Sisu − it’s a mindset which is really 4 things. Number 1, it’s an unshakable self-belief. I’m not talking arrogance here; I’m talking self-worth and self-respect. Number 2, it’s optimism. Optimism is a multiplier; optimism is contagious, so it’s a really important part of sisu. Number 3, it’s perseverance, so it’s that sometimes you have to be a bit stubborn. All of the entrepreneurs and leaders I’ve met with and interviewed in my research for the Leader’s Mindset they were all failure pioneers. They’d al failed more, but they were very stubborn, they were very determined, and they were not going to give up. Then the final part of sisu is resilience. It’s that ability when we’re all going to face our own Mt. Everest at some point in life. It could be losing a loved one, it could be a disease, it could be an accident. It’s really that ability to not be defeated by failure, to get back up, and to continue the battle.

Scott Harper: As you say, failure is half of success.

Terence Mauri: Yes. There’s a great story from Arianna Huffington, the co-founder of The Huffington Post. Over 36 publishers rejected her first book. They said to her, “Don’t give up the day job.” She told her mother this, and as only mothers can be − very loyal − her mother said, “Don’t worry, Arianna. Failure is not the opposite of success; it’s a stepping stone to success.”

Scott Harper: There you go.

Pam Harper: Scott actually came from the world of science research, [and has that perspective as well].

Scott Harper: That’s right. I did research for a consumer products group on Listerine and other products. We would say, “Well, Edison said that I haven’t failed, I’ve found a thousand ways not to make the light bulb. We are continuing to find out what won’t work so we can go to what does.” And that’s what we did.

Terence Mauri: I think those words of wisdom are so true. James Dyson, the innovator behind the Dyson vacuum cleaner, he’s got the same mindset very much. I think for the first Dyson vacuum, they failed over 5,000 times before they actually found the right combination. His mindset was not that he was failure. Actually, failure is learning.

Pam Harper: That’s right, and actually that takes us to the third mindset − the learn fast mindset that you’ve talked about. I thought this was particularly interesting, because you had some unique perspectives about the different ways that we learn. Most especially, knowledge networking; can you talk about that a little bit?

Terence Mauri: Knowledge networking is a critical part of the leader’s mindset. We’re all wired to connect. That’s the way that we’re built in our DNA, we’re hardwired to connect. Knowledge networking means 3 things; one, how you process information. We’re seeing now through the proliferation of apps, for example, ebooks; Just on the App Store alone that gives you access to over 3 billion people and millions of apps. How we process information is the first part of knowledge networking. Number 2, how you build reciprocal high trust-high value relationships. Number 3, it’s about getting the job done. Knowledge networking, I think, has never been more important than in the age of disruption, because there’s a concept known as the half-life knowledge principle, which is a bit like Moore’s law. It’s is this idea that we know today is being eroded faster and faster. If you look at scientific publications for example − and Scott will know about this − if you look at scientific publications 3, 4, 5 years ago, that they’re being superseded and replaced at a faster and faster rate.

Scott Harper: Absolutely.

Terence Mauri: You only have to go to China, for example, to see the speed and scale of change happening there. They’re building cities within not years or months, weeks.

Pam Harper: Terence, I have a question about something you just said. There’s so much knowledge out there. How does somebody not get overwhelmed by it? How do we, as think-even-bigger kinds of leaders who want to win, and want to make sure we get hold of it all − how we know which [sources of knowledge] to go to?

Scott Harper: Isn’t that where the purpose comes back?

Terence Mauri: I think Scott hit the nail on the head there. I think the clearer the purpose, the clearer your leadership why, the clearer are your motivations and your drive. Then that should act as a framework for filtering and evaluating and prioritizing what really matters. I think one of the biggest threats to the leader’s mindset − one of the biggest threats to society − is information overload. I’ve seen examples of people walking into fountains because they’ve been looking at their mobile. The shocking statistics is the rate of selfie-related accidents has gone up over 500% in the last year.

Scott Harper: Oh my word…

Terence Mauri: Yes, because we’re so distracted. What I’d say, Pam, is start with clarity of mind, and when you choose learning it should relate to the overall purpose. It could be what I call the 5-hour rule. The way that works is allocate 45 to 60 minutes a day to focus learning. Remember, learning can happen in many different ways.

Pam Harper: Exactly.

Terence Mauri: A month ago I joined incubator − a community really, a community for startups, for thinkers, for doers − it’s called Second Home. It’s based in London. It’s such a great space that encourages the creative collusion of ideas. We curate speakers, not just from business but from the arts, many different disciplines. Because I think innovation in the 21st century happens at the intersect of different industries and disciplines.

Pam Harper: That is very, very true. This really leads to how we can all do this. We’re going to get into that in our third segment. Right now we’re going to take a quick break, and when we come back we’ll talk more with Terence Mauri about those 3 immediately useful ideas to apply the leader’s mindset so you can win in the age of disruption. Stay with us.

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Pam Harper: Welcome back to Growth Igniters Radio with Pam Harper and Scott Harper. Over the last 2 segments Scott and I have been speaking with Terence Mauri about the leader’s mindset as the foundation for winning in the age of disruption. Terence, tell us how can people find out more about you and your speaking?

Terence Mauri: I’d recommend my website first of all − www.terencemauri.com. Listeners can also join my community on Twitter, which is @terencemauri. In terms of speaking, listeners can also find out where I’m going to be speaking in terms of the book tour in October by going on to my website.

Pam Harper: That’s great, and I know that you’re very active on Twitter; that’s how we first met.

Terence Mauri: I think it highlights the connectivity of the world now. I really appreciate how these connections can happen. It’s quite magical really.

Pam Harper: Let’s talk about … you, in your book, talked about these as “hacks and shortcuts,” which I really love, for developing the leader’s mindset for 10X improvement. We were just talking now about chance kinds of things, and you talk about making your own luck.

Terence Mauri: Yes.

Scott Harper: How do we do that?

Terence Mauri: Well, I met an inspirational lady called Georgina Harwood, and she’s somebody who embodies this 10X mindset − all 3 mindsets, thinking big, acting bold, and learning fast. She was born in the 1920’s, a difficult time − Great Depression, just after the First World War. She’d always had the ambition to study English at university, but life has a way of throwing events in front of you as we’ve seen over the last few days with Brexit. She put that dream on hold for over 70 years. At the age of 83 she decided to go to university. She completed her Bachelors of Arts in English, and when she graduated she was twice as old as the professor. This wasn’t the end of the story though.

Basically she said, “I make my own luck now, and you’ve got to own who you are. You’ve got to be the CEO of your own life.” She decided to do a Masters. Last year she celebrated her 100th birthday. For her 100th birthday she said, “What can I do that I’ve never done before that makes me feel alive at a cellular level?” Because if you think about it often we just do the same as we’ve always done. We live in the status quo, and sometimes not taking a risk is a risk. For her 100th birthday she decided to do a parachute jump. I’m not recommending that our listeners or you guys do this. I haven’t done it myself yet.

Scott Harper: It’s on my list.

Terence Mauri: It’s on my list in my bucket list. She did a parachute jump. She did a tandem dive and she videoed it as well. What an inspirational lady, really fantastic.

Scott Harper: So what’s a practical thing that someone can do − an action that someone can take very soon to make their own luck

Terence Mauri: There’s 3 practical actions that our listeners can do immediately. It’s a change of attitude. Number 1, you’ve got to be open to change, and that means try something new. I’d recommend different types of networking events, for example. You’ve got to get yourself a mentor and I would say not just one mentor but go for multiple mentors. In that way you can accelerate your learning and your luck very quickly.

Pam Harper: One thing to put in here is that mentors can be those who are live and mentors can be those who come to us through books or other venues, and you talked about that.

Terence Mauri: We forget this but its so true, Pam. That’s we should build up what I call an intelligence panel, an intelligence network. These mentors who inspire us with new learning and fresh thinking and help us see the world in different place they can come from living or dead.

Pam Harper: What would be a second area where somebody could concretely do something right away?

Terence Mauri: Number 2, I would say is get some feedback. We often live our lives with blind spots; we’re blind to our own blindness. I think a very practical action is seek objective feedback from people you respect around you, you work with professionaly and non-professionaly, and find out where the gaps are. It’s actionable and it can really … It’s a shortcut to success, so that self-awareness, that self-understanding is the foundation of the leader’s mindset. I think the second piece of practical advice is ask them all for feedback, developmental feedback because that will help you grow faster.

Pam Harper: One of the things that I’ve always thought of too, is going to people you don’t normally ask. If you’re putting down a list of who you’re going to ask for feedback, you might try somebody that you wouldn’t normally go to so you can get a different perspective. What do you think?

Terence Mauri: I think there’s a principle known as the “self-similarity principle,” which says that we’re part of a tribe, really, and it’s very easy if we just go to people within our own inner circle. We’re going to get what we’re already new so I think shifting the perspective, going outside of your immediate circle is really powerful.

Scott Harper: It is. It can also feel risky and a little scary, but if we embrace the concept that risk improves us and takes us to new places, that you’ve talked about, it’s very much part and parcel of expanding our minds and then creating this really strong mindset. What’s one more thing, one practical step someone can take to expand their leader’s mindset?

Terence Mauri: Pam mentioned it earlier, which is this information overload. Herbert Simon, a Nobel laureate, says a wealth of information leads to a poverty of attention. He wrote that in the 70’s − so very prescient and very forward thinking. I think the final practical point would be look at your time like money; we often spend time. I want the listeners now to think about what are they doing to invest time. Also think about time in terms of time credit and time debt. You earn time credits when you plan, anticipate, think before acting, when you slow down, when you reflect, when you review what you’re doing, when you say not yet and push back and protect your time, so that’s a time credit.

You create time debt, which manifests itself in stress, and bad hair, and sleepless nights − you create time debt when you never plan, when you’re always reacting, when everything’s urgent. The problem with social media − one of the downsides of the connectivity now that surrounds us, is that we’re always on. Everything’s urgent, everything’s now, everything’s immediate. The art of thinking you’ve got to adopt is to be able to think fast and think slow. And so a practical action is to slow down, plan more, treat your time like money; very important.

Scott Harper: Yeah, it’s true. Going back into our old common wisdom, there’s the one of “less haste, more speed.” That’s easy to say, but hard to do.

Pam Harper: One of Scott’s favorite sayings.

Terence Mauri: I like that quote, Scott.

Pam Harper: It all comes down to, in a way, to breaking out of habits that we’ve adopted as just almost unconsciously going through life on some of these things. What you’re calling to our attention is how mindful we really do need to be. Terence, can you share with us a final thought on the leader’s mindset?

Terence Mauri: I’ve really enjoyed the conversation and look forward to meeting you guys in person hopefully at some point.

Pam Harper: Oh, absolutely, when you’re in New York.

Terence Mauri: I’d like to visit. Yes. Likewise if you visit London your dollar now goes quite far.

Pam Harper: We have to think about that.

Scott Harper: Final thoughts?

Terence Mauri: Final thoughts. Look, I think the advantages are huge for leaders who can tap the genius of the leader’s mindset − so purpose, energy, the courage to think big. My final 3 points are: remember 960 months, what are going to do with that time? One, be a voracious avid learner, and be passionately curious, and never stop learning. Two, find multiple mentors because that will accelerate your growth. Finally, number 3, most importantly, get into the game. There’s no substitute for doing it.

Pam Harper: Terence. Again, this has been a lot of fun, and we look forward to having more conversations with you because as the world is changing there’s going to be much more of a call for us all to continue to think even bigger, and act even bolder, and learn even more, even sooner.

Terence Mauri: Pam, Scott, thanks again for the interview. I’ve really enjoyed it.

Scott Harper: Thanks, Terence. It’s been a pleasure. And thanks to you out there for listening. To get show notes and resource links for this week’s episodes and other episodes that relate to it go to GrowthIgnitersRadio.com, select episode 157.

Pam Harper: Until next time. This is Pam Harper…

Scott Harper: And Scott Harper…

Pam Harper: Wishing you continued success and leaving you with this question to discuss with your team:

Scott Harper: What will it take for us to expand our mindsets every day to think even bigger, and act even bolder so we can win in the age of disruption?